I appreciate the Mayor's plea for more taxes. But when I compare the numbers I find it hard to justify and see frugality.

For example, According to indeed.com the average salary for a Cleveland Firefighter is about $50,000. Most appear much lower compared to what I see on this site. I invite you to view. http://www.indeed.com/salary/q-Firefighter-l-Cleveland,-OH.html

Meanwhile Avon Lake salaries appear to be close to double that of Cleveland, which in my mind is a much tougher position.
Without listing names, here are the top AL Firefighter salaries.

Fire salary...$114,800
Fire salary...$111,882
Fire salary...$108,890
Fire salary...$100,382
Fire salary...$96,408
Fire salary...$95,901
Fire salary...$95,593
Fire salary...$91,115
Fire salary...$90,823
Fire salary...$89,258
Fire salary...$88,288
Fire salary...$87,295
Fire salary...$86,539
Fire salary...$86,497

Here is the source: http://avon-oh.patch.com/articles/firefighters-utility-workers-top-city-salary-list#pdf-9056410

I appreciate the city has lost funds but so has my income dropped and my expenses increased. I cannot continue to support tax increases until the economy improves and we can all see light at the end of the tunnel.

My income has also gone down as well as the fact I have to pay more for my healthcare. The difference is that education and safety are not cyclical and there have always been people on fixed or reduced incomes during recessionary periods. To not fund the basics of our community is irresponsible.

The salaries posted above are not that high for individuals responsible for the safety of our community. To use these to try and sway people from a responsible vote is just professional/class warfare.

If a business has a drop in activity, they must cut costs to remain profitable. The problem with the argument above is that education and safety never have a drop in activity or demand and to believe everything can be reduced and have no impact on our community is a mistake. Do we think that a Mayor or Superintendent enjoy having to go to voters?

No individual is going to ever be able to pay back in taxes what it costs to educate even one child so a lack of support is just a "cut and run" with a government subsidy. Our responsibility to those providing safety does not end in our senior years or with reduced salaries. I intend on cutting back spending in other areas so I can support the safety and education of my grandchildren, and hopefully, their children.

What if the younger generation believed they wouldn't receive a Social Security payment in their senior years and that they are earning less than those in the previous generation? Seniors only receive SS and Medicare through the contributions of today's workers. Could you imagine a vote to opt out of contributing to that?

Let's have a discussion without demonizing our public employees for what they make!!!

We all know that salaries will never go up after being lowered and education programs are not restored after years of cuts. Our community is not Cleveland nor should it be compared to such. Safety and education activities do not cease and the funding of these things should be a priority regardless of other variables. Trying to scare or infuriate people with salary information has nothing to do with the actual need for the funds. It would be irresponsible to cut funding to safety and education - the backbones of our society!

Good discussion here. I appreciate the civility of it.

Since there are comments about salaries, I am going to include the following information: Zilka also noted in his comments that service clerical workers, police and fire personnel have taken a 0 percent increase through June 30, 2014.

I'd be OK with a renewal (keep taxes the same). It's the increase I have a MAJOR issue with. The mayor cries fox in the hen house if we don't cough up more money. Why can't we keep it the same? I truly believe it would be passed with a strong majority.

From prior articles - the mayor listed cuts that would have to be made if this failed. I could live without most of those. This has been handled poorly. The majority voted a few months ago and it should be respected, not keep threatening FF costs vs. "Movies in the Park" and "Park Attendants (prior article).

Welcome to Issue 2 failing -- the State had to make the cuts and the local's are crying broke. Their are simply better answers to this problem that currently presented.

While this levy may not be about salaries don't you think its fair to look at the whole picture.
I don't deny people should try to get the best pay they can, but the issue is not just this levy but all public spending. It just seems to be a bottomless pit of spending upon spending. Normal business can't do it so why should public entities be able to do it.

I agree with the public spending issue. But also believe that tax revenues should be allocated to the local level where we can decide how to spend them. Federal spending is out of control. I think the state made arbitrary cuts without studying what would happen with local communities. This is the place - cities and schools - where we can be assured of a highly efficient use of our tax dollars.

I don't think we should punish non-cyclical public entities because our federal government has acted irresponsibly.

Normal, private business cuts spending and investment when business activity decreases; Public schools and communities do not have a decrease in activity unless city population falls. Actually, there is an increase in activity here based on higher population and enrollment in the schools. Children's education will suffer without funding and I don't think that should happen regardless of economic situation. Let's keep our dollars working for us locally and hold the federal government responsible for out-of-control spending.

Firefighters recieve over-time pay for a full day even if they only get called in for 5 minutes. How much overtime is getting paid to them? I work full time and if I come in or work over I am paid by the hour not an entire days worth of work. I support figherfighters and paramedics but realistically they are over-payed. Who makes that kind of money? Even degree holders do not see that amount of salary in their life time!
Please Mr. Zilka do not take money from our children's programs. We reside here so our children can have better lives and telling us that if this levy doesn't pass, programs for our children will be cut. It is a separate issue and one should not affect the other.

There has never been a conversation that was productive which revolves around someones salary being appropriate or not. This is just an inference that what one does for a living is somehow harder or more important than what another does. I'm sure if many of us had our salaries from private business posted, others would think we were over payed. None of us can truly say what another should earn because we have not walked in their shoes or done their job.

Military pay is another issue and, I agree, should be much higher. That is not relative to this discussion though, about spending local dollars. It is apples-to-oranges to compare our fire and medical specialists to Cleveland.

I personally do not have an issue with renewal of the current tax level for the paramedics, etc but I find it difficult to understand a justification for the increase.

Avon Lake has already taken steps to address budget shortfalls as noted in the article (why was there no mention that the garbage collection contribution from the city has been discontinued yielding over $700,000 in savings for 2013 and each year thereafter).

I support the firefighters and paramedics and believe they deserve a handsome wage and excellent benefits which would be adequately covered by a renewal levy. The justification for an increase in the levy appears to be the citys attempt to redistribute the city's tax wealth using the good will enjoyed by the paramedics and firefighters as a diversion.

I never said they didn't deserve their salaries. I am simply stating they are over-paid, period. I support what they do and believe in them full heartedly but the bottom line is what is the justification for this levy? How much more in taxes am I going to have to pay? The school district has a levy on the ballot as well and that is amost $100 a month increase. Lets figure out a solution as a community!

So this past weekend I unfortunately missed a visit to my door from our Mayor. What's interesting is that with the union rules/contracts over 40 (or whatever is contracted) hours per week, etc., they all get overtime - and from the numbers posted a lot of it! How many of us in the real world work more than that - and don't get any overtime - it is just what it takes to get the job done and perhaps earn $100k+ or likely A LOT LESS. Plus they get sick time, a lot of vaction, and don't forget that PERS lifetime benefit too.

Here's where the city leadership screwed-up: 1.) they should have gone for a renewal (not the increase too), 2.) they then should have "studied"/understood the future needs across the city before asking for ANY INCREASE, 3.) also should have avoid asking for a renewal with a major school levy (don't get me started on the fast move Special Election), 4.) since they Mayor already enjoys a lavish teachers pension - if he's truly doing the job to serve and pushing for the levy give-back the $100k salary+ PERS, 5.) have all the emergency workers agree to real working hours like the rest of us and only take overtime once they hit 50/55 hrs a week ot not at all. I'll vote for the schools (at least it is overall well run and really got screwed by Columbus) but I haven't been given a real reason to vote for a increase for this levy with the "Avon Lake 1%" being our civil servants!

Another thought too...why not have the Mayor, instead of getting as Zuber did a $8-9k car allowance, drive one of those old police cars or like most of us pay for a car to/from work out of our take home pay?

For several years, the supplemental funding from the state and federal level that Avon Lake relied on for schools, safety, roads, etc has steadily declined. The Mayor(s) and Council have worked to attract new businesses with the goal of generating significant new revenue sources to offset the state and federal reductions. A few years back, the city had the forethought to set aside funds to cover unforeseen emergencies. By managing the "Rainy Day Fund", the city has been able to delay the very situation for which we are now faced.

This year, the results of decisions to increase the cost of basic services (approx $70 combined for water, sewage and trash) are showing up in the October mail. For some residents, the question is not whether they support quality education or professional safety, the question is whether they can afford increases in their taxes at this time. And, while while firefighters earning an average of over $90K is not the issue, it is a really big concern.

If the increase levies are not supported next month, I encourage the city to place renewal levies on the next earliest ballot.

I too found the salaries you posted absurd, but then I did some research. According to their contract, as posted on the Ohio SERB website, the firefighters work an average of 50 hours per week before receiving any overtime. Also, the salary of a fire/paramedic in the Avon Lake Fire Department starts at 51,603.90 and tops out at 68,603.34. Call it 70,000 with uniform allowance and some longevity. If my calculations are correct, the guy who made 114,800 would have worked an average of 67.42 hours per week. He should be commended for his dedication. Also they are not in PERS. (semantics perhaps, but if you portray something as fact, please get it right)

As a resident and a veteran it upsets me to see our local heroes dragged into what seems to be an issue with elected officials. I urge everyone to vote for issue 10. Keep our community great and take your issues up with your councilperson. Remember you can vote them out too.

Barbara ~ I would be willing to believe what you say if you had ever posted in a civil manner but you seem to also be on a mission to nix any tax that is needed. The person who made the robocall was wrong about the dollar flow and owes the community an apology for wasting our time. He is unable to interpret financial data regardless of whether it comes from the city or schools.

I look forward to a comment or letter from you which sounds happier, thankful, in favor of something, or supportive of people who work hard to do their jobs. Try to get rid of the sour tone!